LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Planning and discussing Freeciv Longturn gaming
Canik
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Canik » Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:07 pm

Corbeau wrote:You forget that there were 7 games open and that not everybody was eager to play in all of them. That's why all spots were not filled. In the first few games there were no empty spots very quickly. Now that there is only one, I don't think it's a problem if it's so massive.

Bruh, I joined G2 at turn 72. And joined a few turns later with a few multis. (I've stopped using the multis tho. I made them b4 I knew it was a rule.) Only G1 had an issue and the issue was not so much player spots as it was the small landmass + multis. I was able to join G1 there just wasn't anywhere to build.

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Corbeau
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Corbeau » Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:32 pm

Did you enter into empty player slots or you replaced idlers? If I recall correctly, you appeared to my north replacing someone who already made some cities.

janebond
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby janebond » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:15 pm

Hello everybody,

it's really a pitty you had to close all this games. I was probably also a reason for the closure. I joined Lt 5 at turn 15 or so. in the following weeks all the other games too. in lt 3 i got an idler without any citys, just settlers, around turn 90. in lt 2 i got a tiny little 2 city nation. but nice neighbours. i could join a friendly alley before i got overrun by sasake. in lt 4 i got a good nation with 4 nice citys, good tech.

after 3 weeks maybe my girlfriend joined too. we often use one another's laptop when we are at the other's place. so we looked probably like cheaters

we joined both lt8

and i don't like this needed google-account

Canik
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Canik » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:22 pm

I replaced someone but it's hard to see how that is very relevant. Joining as a brand new nation wouldn't necessarily be better.

What is your goal here exactly? To make the map so huge and the player spots so many that someone can join at turn 130 and still get an unfounded civilization in untouched land with room to expand? And this one game is going to last how long?

From your posts before I know you didn't like the amount of new games being made so I suppose part of your motive here to make less games that can be joined later but there are pitfalls to that too. Like what if you get killed early then you have no new game to join for a good long while. Also, joining at turn 130 you're going to almost certainly have issues building a nation of any sort of relevance. That isn't exactly super fun for the new players. If it's retaining new players that you want having semi-regular new, fresh games is probably better than having them still be able to join at turn 130 as a new nation instead of replacement. (they will have a chance to AT LEAST join as a replacement in my system)

You almost seem to want to make this some everlasting 1-world MMORPG people can still join a year from now. I mean, maybe having a game or two like that would be cool and fine but I don't believe that should be the standard.

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Corbeau
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Corbeau » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:52 pm

You need to pay attention to the conversation.

You said that there were lots of empty spots in games.

I said that this was due to a lot of games and that applied only for late games, in early games all spots got taken, in later games less people joined in because they were busy in earlier games.

You said that there was room because you were able to enter at turn 72.

I said that you replaced an idler, not entered an "empty spot".

There were no empty spots long after the start. Game 2 was full AT MOST 30 days after the start (no way of knowing when exactly). In Game 1 (150 players) there were no empty spots AT MOST 10 days after the start.

Well, basically, I don't care because I either enter a game in the beginning or not at all. But other people had said that it was good that they were able to join in even with a partially defunct nation because then they could get a feel of the game, in stead of having to wait and, if they liked it, it would be easier to wait for a new start. Their words, not mine. But I have to ask, what is *your* goal here? To prevent them from doing that? Make them wait until a new game starts and possibly lose them? Because you'll be less patient in waiting for something that you haven't experienced.

There is no perfect way to handle this. Either way there will be problems. But, like I said earlier, I see Freeciv Web as a great way to attract people who otherwise wouldn't bump into this kind of game. For that it is essential that there are openings all the time, literally, so that passers-by can drop in and have a look. For that, some consistency needs to be sacrificed.

In the first 7 games, games were interfering with each other and there were multies so it was hard to determine how they were being filled. We'll see how this one goes. Right now, half a turn has passed and there are 85 players.

Canik
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Canik » Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:57 am

Corbeau wrote:You need to pay attention to the conversation.

You said that there were lots of empty spots in games.

I said that this was due to a lot of games and that applied only for late games, in early games all spots got taken, in later games less people joined in because they were busy in earlier games.

You said that there was room because you were able to enter at turn 72.

I said that you replaced an idler, not entered an "empty spot".

There were no empty spots long after the start. Game 2 was full AT MOST 30 days after the start (no way of knowing when exactly). In Game 1 (150 players) there were no empty spots AT MOST 10 days after the start.


No you need to pay more attention. What I said after that was basically "What's the difference?" Either way I got into the game. Who cares if it was a "true" empty spot or a spot that "opened up" from an idle player?

Well, basically, I don't care because I either enter a game in the beginning or not at all. But other people had said that it was good that they were able to join in even with a partially defunct nation because then they could get a feel of the game, in stead of having to wait and, if they liked it, it would be easier to wait for a new start. Their words, not mine. But I have to ask, what is *your* goal here? To prevent them from doing that? Make them wait until a new game starts and possibly lose them? Because you'll be less patient in waiting for something that you haven't experienced.


That was me who said it was good I could join and get a feel for the game instead of having to wait, lol. And when I said that it when people were talking about putting a cut-off date on when people join games. That's what it was in reference to, not this. What I'm proposing would still allow newcomers to join most games even if it's late in the game. They just might have to replace an idler if it's turn 70 instead of getting a brand new nation. And there will be idlers, for sure. You yourself said earlier that there will always be idlers (or something along those lines)

There is no perfect way to handle this. Either way there will be problems. But, like I said earlier, I see Freeciv Web as a great way to attract people who otherwise wouldn't bump into this kind of game. For that it is essential that there are openings all the time, literally, so that passers-by can drop in and have a look. For that, some consistency needs to be sacrificed.

In the first 7 games, games were interfering with each other and there were multies so it was hard to determine how they were being filled. We'll see how this one goes. Right now, half a turn has passed and there are 85 players.


40 multis probably. Google accounts are free and you can make as many as you want. Minus multi-accounts I'm like 99% sure I'd be right and you'd be very wrong.. but with multis probably still existing (unless I'm missing something on how that works).. yeah, it might get pretty full at first. Tho many will go inactive as they always do and by the time it's full there will probably be idler spots newcomers can take which means they still get in the game and it's little difference from getting a "true" empty spot.

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Corbeau
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Corbeau » Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:02 am

Canik wrote:No you need to pay more attention. What I said after that was basically "What's the difference?" Either way I got into the game. Who cares if it was a "true" empty spot or a spot that "opened up" from an idle player?

If there are less spots, there is a chance you won't make it into the game if you get at just about the time late enough that all slots are taken and early enough that nobody has been idle for, what, 12 turns? What was the cutoff? Which was exactly the case in Game 1 for a short period of time.

Marduk
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Marduk » Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:24 am

Some posts here are a bit too negative. Remember that however much time we invest in these games, Andreas invests way more to keep it running. Must be very frustrating for him to see hackers trying to destroy it. But this is a strong community, so they won't succeed!

Zelrond
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby Zelrond » Mon Sep 11, 2017 12:59 pm

Marduk wrote:Some posts here are a bit too negative. Remember that however much time we invest in these games, Andreas invests way more to keep it running. Must be very frustrating for him to see hackers trying to destroy it. But this is a strong community, so they won't succeed!


This. Im pretty sad too, i loved game 2 over the rest and the cheating affected it the least at that advanced point. So i feel that saying I fall between the most affected players isn't so wrong, but still i understand what happened and just want to play again this time with much lesser cheating problems and such.

I loved that game, and want to play more of that kind of games.

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AndreasR
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Re: LongTurn Game 8 for Freeciv-web

Postby AndreasR » Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:37 pm

The results of LongTurn games 1-7 will be posted on the Freeciv-web discord channel now.